International non-UnionPay card + ATM usage experience sharing and summary in mainland China

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国际非银联卡+中国大陆ATM 使用经验分享和小结

foreword

ATM withdrawal is the most basic, most stable and least risk-controlled type of financial activities.

However, when using an international card to withdraw money from ATMs in mainland China, there will be various common problems and restrictions. Here is a summary.

Transaction Channel Classification

  1. Physical card insertion, card swiping
  2. Physical card contactless*Contactless card
  3. Virtual card contactless*ApplePay, GooglePay, etc.
  4. Virtual Card Information*Stripe, PayPal, Alipay, etc.
  5. QR codes and other digital verification

For mainland China ATM + international card, 5 is basically useless, 4 is basically useless, 3 is not good for most ATMs, 2 may not be as good as 3, 1 is generally good

Frequently Asked Questions, Limitations and Other Knowledge Points

  1. International card withdrawals are allowed, but deposits are not . It is recommended that peer ATMs deposit mainland cards instead of cross-bank deposits. Now, most mainland ATMs also support peer mobile QR code login.
  2. Prepaid cards don’t necessarily affect ATM withdrawals
  3. Most non-large financial companies have poor ability to identify international ATM withdrawals and have many loopholes
  4. ATMs in mainland China, in most cases, do not charge extra handling fees for international cards (including credit cards and debit cards) that cooperate with Africa, but daily inter-bank charges in mainland China
  5. ATMs in mainland China, when using an international card to withdraw cash, the general limit of a single transaction is 3,000 yuan, and there seems to be no other restrictions .
  6. Withdrawing cash with an international card at an ATM in mainland China is different from withdrawing cash at an international ATM with a mainland China card. The latter is not only about the exchange rate, but also has various limits and handling fees.
  7. It is known that some ATMs of China Construction Bank, Industrial and Commercial Bank of China, and Agricultural Bank of China (usually in big cities such as Shanghai) support ApplePay non-UnionPay international card ATM withdrawals, and others are basically not supported. I have not found any of them that belong to Ouke. Generally speaking, you can only withdraw cash by inserting a physical card .
  8. Some do not support checking the balance , for example, it will display “Not accepted” and then force the card to be refunded
  9. Non-mainland cards are often 4-digit PINs (passwords) instead of the 6-digit PINs generally used by mainland cards. In actual use, enter 4 digits and then confirm. It is really impossible to add 2 0s, but it is recommended to give up instead of continuing to avoid swallowing the card.
  10. There is no problem with withdrawing from the same ATM and then depositing the Mainland Travel Card in seconds. If you are not afraid of shadows, you should think about it yourself.

Exchange Rates and Fees

  1. ATMs in mainland China, in most cases, there is no mandatory currency conversion *DCC, generally CNY is credited, and the bank exchange rate is used
  2. The reason for saying that it is the bank exchange rate is that the exchange rate that some banks may use is not the exchange rate of the card organization, such as HSBC and the domestic and overseas branches of most local Chinese banks
  3. There may be fees, exchange rate issues, and handling charges when using cards issued overseas by Chinese domestic banks to withdraw from domestic ATMs. Their channels are different.
  4. Most non-large financial companies have poor ability to identify international ATM withdrawals and have many loopholes
  5. Is it unclear whether the real-time exchange rate is displayed, and the crediting speed is unclear. My RevolutUS debit card is credited in seconds , and the real-time exchange rate (when the card is paid, the real-time exchange rate is not credited in seconds)
  6. Most credit cards can be recognized as cash services *Cash Advance, avoid using credit cards , but a few cards such as Brex are not only unclear, but also cash back
  7. Some banks will charge ATM cash withdrawal fees, currency conversion fees, international transaction fees, international cash withdrawal fees, etc., and even risk control

Practical case

The process is very simple, I tested RevolutUS prepaid debit card, Bank of China ATM.

  1. The physical card contactless failure, ApplePay failure, directly insert the card and enter the 4-digit pin to log in.
  2. Ask what type of account you have, there are credit, checking, savings, etc., it should be checking.
  3. Then check the balance or withdraw cash, I tried to check the balance, and it directly prompted “No acceptance” and then flipped the card, which caused me to insert it again.
  4. Then directly enter the amount to request cash, and you can complete it. Finally, remember to print the voucher receipt.
  5. Then insert the physical debit card of Bank of China, insert the card and enter the 6-digit pin to log in, and then deposit it back in place.

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The account is credited in seconds, RMB is credited, and the bank exchange rate is used. It is displayed as cash withdrawal, but the free quota of “non-cooperative network ATM cash withdrawal” is not deducted.

I checked the instructions on the official website, but I didn’t see that it didn’t count. It should be a system identification problem.

https://www.revolut.com/en-LT/help/making-payments/withdrawing-cash/does-revolut-charge-for-cash-withdrawal

https://www.revolut.com/en-US/help/making-payments/withdrawing-cash/does-revolut-charge-for-cash-withdrawal

https://www.revolut.com/en-US/help/making-payments/withdrawing-cash/how-do-i-withdraw-cash

The exchange rate is 1CNY=》0.1554USD, which is 1USD=6.4350CNY

At this time, the exchange rate of the platform is as follows [CNYtoUSD (consumption CNY, USD repayment), has been converted, equivalent to overseas card mainland use]

  • Revolut 6.4350
  • Google 6.44529
  • VISA 6.406398
  • MasterCard 6.4135
  • WISE 6.44655
  • UnionPay 6.3905 [USD to CNY is 6.4221, equivalent to a mainland card, used overseas]

So obviously, it is not the card organization exchange rate (visa, MasterCard, UnionPay, etc.), but the market exchange rate (the market exchange rate used by Revolut, wise, Google)

Analysis of common card ATM fees and limits

WISE

WISE Business UK and WISE Personal cards are the most common. Personal cards need to be forwarded to overseas addresses, and commercial cards can be mailed directly to the mainland.

①According to the instructions on the official website https://wise.com/help/articles/2935769/how-much-does-it-cost-to-withdraw-cash

If your card was issued in Europe or the UK: You can take out money for free twice a month — as long as the total amount is under 200 GBP/EUR. But after that, we’ll charge you 0.50 GBP/EUR per transaction . This is a fixed fee. If you take out over 200 GBP/EUR in one month, we’ll charge you 1.75% on top of that.

Cards issued by EU and UK are free twice or the amount is less than 200 units, and you will need to pay for more than 0.5+1.75% for a single transaction

②According to the data shown in my WISE Business UK account

Single limit 1000GBP, daily limit 1500GBP, monthly limit 3000GBP

③WISE is not a merchant without FTF. Although its exchange rate is the market exchange rate, there is a handling fee.

Fee Reference Calculator (visible if not logged in) https://wise.com/gb/pricing/business/send-money

Reference data as of April 21, 2022 is as follows (subject to change, errors)

  1. GBPtoCNY is 1.04%
  2. GBPtoUSD is 0.41%
  3. GBPtoHKD is 0.45%
  4. USD to CNY is 1.06%
  5. USDtoGBP is 0.43%
  6. USDtoHKD is 0.47%
  7. EURtoCNY is 1.1%
  8. EURtoUSD is 0.47%
  9. EURtoGBP is 0.47%
  10. EURtoHKD is 0.51%

Capital One

C1 family bucket (Checking, Saving, Credit card, Debit card) is a common choice among ITIN users

①According to the instructions on the official website https://www.capitalone.com/help-center/checking-savings/international-atm-fees/

For 360 products (360 Checking, Money, etc.) there are no additional fees when you use your debit card abroad (any transaction made in a foreign currency or that MasterCard® classifies as a cross-border transaction).

For non-360 products (Total Control Checking, Essential Checking and other products) we may charge a fee of $2, plus 3% of the total transaction amount, when you withdraw from an international ATM (outside of the United States, Puerto Rico, and the US Virgin Islands).

②According to the instructions on the official website https://www.capitalone.com/credit-cards/faq/

Capital One does not charge a fee for using your credit card for foreign currency transactions. Foreign purchases will be converted at the foreign exchange rate in effect at the time of processing the charge. Read more about foreign transaction and currency conversion fees .

③ According to the instructions on the official website https://www.capitalone.com/learn-grow/money-management/foreign-transaction-fees/

Some cards—like Capital One’s US-issued credit cards and 360 Checking account debit cards —don’t charge foreign transaction fees. But if your card does, the actual cost can vary, depending on which credit, debit or prepaid card you use. The fees may generally be in the area of ​​3% of your purchase, though. You can check your card’s terms and conditions to see what fees there are.

Using your debit card to withdraw cash while abroad could be a way to avoid foreign transaction fees, if your card doesn’t charge them.

But you might be charged international withdrawal ATM fees with some types of accounts. For example, Capital One doesn’t charge any additional international ATM withdrawal fees when you use 360 ​​Checking and MONEY products abroad. But you could be charged a fee by the ATM operator. And there may be fees for non-360 products —like Total Control Checking, Essential Checking and other products—when you use an ATM outside of the US and its territories.

④ According to the instructions on the official website https://www.capitalone.com/bank/checking-accounts/online-checking-account/disclosures/

Total card purchases and withdrawals are limited to $5,000 per day. This includes ATM withdrawals, cash advances, and signature and PIN-based purchases. Withdrawals from an ATM made using a 360 Checking Card are limited to $1,000 per day.

summary

According to this information, using the most common C1 Checking (that is, the 360 ​​Checking series), using ATMs in mainland China to withdraw cash is also 0 fee, and C1 has no FTF, so it can be said to be lossless. The daily limit is 1000USD.

Schwab International

Charles Schwab International Card has a VISA ATM card, which has no FTF and ATM fees, and will reimburse the fees charged by ATMs at the same time, but ATMs in mainland China do not charge extra for this, so the advantage is not obvious. If it is Thailand and other countries, it is very It’s possible that atm is not free to use, and Schwab reimbursed for this.

A similar product is the Schwab Bank (US) debit card, which offers the same treatment, but the US version requires travel registration.

I don’t know if the daily withdrawal limit is 1000USD, and other limits are dynamic. It is said that his family has Chinese customer service and Hong Kong outlets, but they are not very reliable.

Fidelity

Fidelity’s is also similar to Schwab, and it is also a brokerage, but it needs a US tax ID number and ITIN.

There is no wire transfer fee for the account and card, and the fee charged by the ATM will be reimbursed. It is said that FTF is 1%, but it seems that some ATMs do not trigger FTF. It is said that it is related to the processing method of ATM.

The daily withdrawal limit may be 500USD. International withdrawals require travel registration. His family is said to have poor customer service and ink marks.

VELO by East West Bank East West Bank

VELO is the easiest bank with lower threshold, but like wise, it is also the hardest hit area for closing accounts and titles. However, velo refunds money quickly, and the check is refunded, and you can also request to transfer it away.

You need a Chinese mainland ID card to open an account. No overseas address is required. If the deposit is less than 2500U, there will be a monthly fee of 25U. At the same time, the account opening requires a deposit of 2500U. Currently, remittances from mainland China are not available. If you have any related questions, you can learn online or consult me .

Now the card supports ApplePay, etc. After opening, it will directly mail you to the mainland address, which is really labor-saving.

According to the official website information https://www.velobank.com/en/disclosure/fee-schedule.html

2 free times per month, follow-up 1USD/time

Velo did not disclose the withdrawal amount publicly, it is said to be 2K USD per day

I didn’t find the FTF description, maybe not

Sable

There was no ftf before December 2021, but it was revised later, and it became 2% ftf

According to the official website information https://help.sablecard.com/hc/en-us/articles/1500005602242-What-are-my-debit-and-credit-card-limits-

Daily atm limit 750USD

According to the official website https://help.sablecard.com/hc/en-us/articles/360035638593-What-fees-does-Sable-charge-

No atm fee but ftf 2%

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